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geohatter: As the owner has not responded to my previous log requesting that they check this cache I am archiving it.

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Traditional Geocache

Moseley St. Mary's Church Nano

A cache by foxtink Send Message to Owner Message this owner
Hidden : 2/8/2011
3.5 out of 5
1 out of 5

Size: Size: other (other)

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Geocache Description:

Moseley St. Mary's Church Nano.
Historical Building with history
Looking for a Magnetic Nano.
Please ensure you place back exactly where you found it.
Please note, GPS signal is not accurate in this area, best signal strengh was 5M, I will keep going back and checking and will update coords when required.

Stealth is essential, your over looked everywhere.. Its a very busy church also, you do not need to enter the church grounds, cache reachable from pavement..

St. Mary's is a historical building (myth or legend)

There is nearby parking on the street. Cache is in easy reach from the pavement.
Suitable for all.

St. Mary's Nano Cache.

Perpetuating the Myth?
The Pope’s mandate of 1405

I, Innocent VII, To the Bishop of Worcester. Mandate to license those of the parishioners of the Church of Bromsgrove in his diocese, who dwell hard by the town of Kings Norton, in the same diocese, and whose petition contained that the said Church is so distant that especially for old men and pregnant women and other weak persons access at certain times of the year on account of the said distance and floods is impossible without danger, to have mass and other divine offices celebrated by fit priests and ecclesiastical sacraments administered in the nearer and more convenient Chapel of St Mary, Moseley within the bounds of the said Church.

Anyone who reads the Pope’s Mandate of 1405, when Henry IV (Bolingbroke) was King of England, cannot fail to notice two things quite clearly: first, the chapel of St Mary, Moseley is mentioned by name and, secondly, it was the petitioning parishioners who were being licensed. What does this mean?

The Chapel of St Mary in Moseley must already have been in existence for it to be mentioned by name in the Pope’s Mandate. There is no direct evidence for this but an ecclesiastical building that did not exist would hardly be referred to by a saint’s name. It must already have been consecrated. In addition, there are references in historical works over the years to the Monks from Bordesley Abbey, near Redditch, administering a Chantry Chapel in Moseley. This would have been a private chapel and hence the need for the Pope to mandate the diocesan Bishop to licence the local parishioners to be able to use it as a place of public worship.

As for the contents of the Petition, no one who has recently written about the History of St Mary’s has read it, as far as I am aware. However, the words of the Mandate make it clear that the Petition was from those parishioners of the church of Bromsgrove who lived ‘hard by the town of Kings Norton’. They were finding it difficult to travel to that church, i.e. their parish church in Bromsgrove. The petition, which was probably to the Bishop not to the Pope, was nothing to do with the building of a chapel of ease as is being suggested. The Mandate clearly says that it was to license the parishioners to have services held in a named chapel not to have a chapel built. It was subsequently, in 1494 or thereabouts, that Queen Elizabeth of York, wife of Henry VII and Lord of the Manor of Kings Norton, gave land from her manorial holdings to have a chapel erected in Moseley and I am sure that two quite separate events nearly a century apart are being kaleidoscoped into one.

We also know that stone from the parsonage at Bromsgrove was transported in 48 loads towards the building of the tower in 1513 which was erected a year later. It is actually made of brick faced with stone and is one of the oldest examples of this type of construction in the country.

Additionally, the clear reference to the petitioners saying that the parish church at Bromsgrove was too far away is being re-interpreted by reference to a document nearly 150 years later to the effect that the parish was quite large and therefore a chapel had been built in Moseley. This document of 1548 is a Memorandum from the Chantry Certificate of Kings Norton in medieval English:

That the said paryshe is vii myles brode every way and fortie myles compass and that many of the same paryshe do dwell foure myles from the paryshe church, and therefore is one chappell buylde by the paryshoners there at a village called Moseley, where Sir Laurence Blakewey doth mynster the sacraments and other necessarye usages in ye said church to dyvers the inhabitants of the said paryshe, dwelling nere to the said chappell which is twoo myles dystante from the said paryshe church.

By this time, Kings Norton church must have been regarded as the Parish Church even though it was not officially given parochial status in the Church of England until 1846.

So, the most that we can say is that the year 1405 was the first time that the villagers in Moseley were given permission to worship in their own village, as far as is known.
Robert Brown

FTFC - AirEd
STFC - mumbo jumbo

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Found it 30     Didn't find it 7     Write note 2     Archive 1     Needs Archived 1     Temporarily Disable Listing 1     Publish Listing 1     Needs Maintenance 1     

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Current Time:
Last Updated: on 11/15/2017 3:21:09 PM (UTC-08:00) Pacific Time (US & Canada) (11:21 PM GMT)
Rendered From:Unknown
Coordinates are in the WGS84 datum

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